Mastering Body Language and Authenticity in Public Speaking: Insights from Rachael Edmondson-Clarke

Have you ever wondered what it really takes to speak confidently in front of any audience—whether it’s a crowded boardroom, a theatre-stage packed with anticipation, or a busy hair salon at age twelve? In this episode of Speaking with Confidence, I welcome back the incredible Rachael Edmondson-Clarke for her second appearance—a rare privilege on this show! Rachael’s journey from sweeping floors in her mom’s beauty salon to leading professional speakers across the UK and Ireland is more than inspirational—it’s a masterclass in authentic communication, building trust, and continuous growth.

In this episode, we dive deep into how early experiences shape our ability to read nonverbal cues, remain genuine, and adapt our energy to truly connect with others. Rachael shares the story of working reception in her mom’s salon—juggling two telephones, a crowd of clients, and a team of stylists—all before she was sixteen! She reflects on how tuning into body language transformed not only her customer service skills but also her capacity to lead and build trust, skills that have served her throughout her career.

Rachael takes us on a whirlwind tour of her professional journey: from impactful presenting workshops, to drama stages, to corporate boardrooms, and finally to becoming vice president of the Professional Speaking Association UK & Ireland. She shares candid lessons from competing in the Speaker Factor competition, including her “banana and dark chocolate” ritual, and how even a tough performance can be the launchpad for real growth when you have the right community supporting you.

We talk about the crucial importance of congruence—making sure your words, body language, and tone all align to build trust and credibility. Rachael’s anecdotes highlight that storytelling isn’t just about big, heroic moments; it’s also about the everyday stories (including her infamous toothbrush battery saga!) that make you relatable and memorable to any audience.

Throughout our conversation, we emphasize how practice, resilience, and vulnerability are key to developing as a speaker. Whether it’s learning from an uncomfortable video replay or dusting off your presentation after setbacks, the journey to confident communication is ongoing—and full of opportunities to embrace humor, share truth, and connect authentically.

Here’s what we cover in this episode:

• How reading body language and energy can elevate your communication—starting at the salon reception desk
• Why being congruent (aligning words and actions) builds trust with any audience
• Rachael’s transition from corporate marketing roles to leading professional speakers—and what she learned along the way
• The value of continuous learning and putting your skills into practice (even if it means watching yourself on video!)
• Behind-the-scenes secrets of the Speaker Factor competition (including performance rituals, nerves, and bouncing back from setbacks)
• The pivotal role of storytelling—why everyday moments matter as much as big, dramatic stories
• Using humor (self-deprecating or otherwise) as a powerful connector and communicator
• Practical advice for anyone looking to build confidence: find your own style, practice, and seek feedback from a supportive community

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome Back And Guest Reintroduction
• 1:56 Value-First Communication Mindset
• 2:58 Lessons From The Salon Reception Desk
• 4:33 Reading Body Language And Energy
• 7:20 Congruence, Trust, And Nonverbal Cues
• 9:28 Corporate Presenting And Stagecraft Growth
• 13:24 Turning The Spotlight To The Audience
• 16:40 Continuous Learning And Practice Habits
• 20:06 Inside The Speaker Factor Journey
• 24:20 From Setback To Stage Confidence
• 28:16 Rituals, Nerves, And Finding Your Way
• 32:24 Storytelling: Everyday Moments That Connect
• 36:24 Humor As A Bridge To Influence
• 39:30 Closing, Contact Details, And Resources

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:09

Welcome back to Speaking with Confidence. Podcast helps you build the soft skills that lead to real results. Communication, storytelling, public speaking, and showing up with confidence in every conversation that counts. I'm Tim Newman, a recovering college professor turn communication coach, and I'm thrilled to guide your own journey to becoming a powerful communicator. Today, we've got a historical episode for you today. We've got Rachel Edmondson Clark back with us. I'm sure you all remember she was on with us last month, and she's only the second person to have a second episode with us. So, Rachel, thank you so much for spending some time with us again today. I'm I'm looking forward to kind of finishing up what we started uh uh a couple weeks ago.

SPEAKER_01: 0:51

Tim, I'm so excited to be back with you, and thank you for having me on the show. I feel incredibly privileged to be only the second person to appear in your episodes twice. So thank you for having me on.

SPEAKER_00: 1:05

Oh, you've got you've got such a great story, and you know, you you're such a personable person, and the the way you share your stories and the way that you share information to help and add value to to the listeners, it's it's it it makes me happy, it makes my heart happy, and I'm and I'm sure that it that it comes across because you know we we've talked a little bit about this. It doesn't really matter what we do. I think it's our responsibility to to make sure that we're providing value to the people that that we're serving. It's not about us, it's about help, it's about helping them, you know, reach reach their goals and reach what what they want to do.

SPEAKER_01: 1:41

Oh, absolutely. And when it's about something then more than ourselves, it feels a lot more meaningful and um rewarding, I think. So and you leave your heart, Tim. It's so clear and obvious to me.

SPEAKER_00: 1:56

Thank you. So let's pick up kind of where we left off. You know, we didn't really get to talk too much about the the communication piece and and how important that is in um professional growth and and personal growth and and and what that actually d does for us in terms of of sharing a message. And we did talk a little bit about, you know, you you started your your career in in your mom's beauty salon.

SPEAKER_01: 2:21

I did. I did, yes.

SPEAKER_00: 2:24

Yeah, so so talk about that from the communication piece because you were how old were you? Were you you were 13, 14?

SPEAKER_01: 2:30

Very yeah, I was I was I was young. I started at the age of 12.

SPEAKER_00: 2:34

Oh 12, okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:36

12 to 21, pretty much. Of course, at 12 I was sweeping the floors, I was making teas and coffees. So it was a hair and beauty salon. And by the age of 14, I'd said to my mum, you know, gosh, I really am bored of making teas and coffees and sweeping the floor up. Can you please train me to do something else? And so the the thing that was most obvious was going to be the reception, and it was a busy salon, so we had over 300 clients a week. We would have, I think, more than 20 staff, and I would be on reception all day on a Saturday, which was an incredibly busy day for the salon back then, and so be managing multiple stylists' columns for all of their work, as well as uh you know a large volume of clients coming in from 8:30 in the morning right through up until 7 pm in the evening. I had two telephone lines, so it was it was the days before the internet when people would phone up for their hair appointments, but that meant that I would sometimes be juggling two telephone lines that would be ringing, and sometimes a sea of people in front of that reception desk, as well as the needs of the stylists and the other members of staff working around me. So uh I would say I yes, I had to learn pretty quickly how to deal with the public, how to get the best out of the team that I was helping to kind of um, I suppose I was orchestrating things in many, many respects, uh, and to balance, to balance all of that.

SPEAKER_00: 4:13

And so so what was your your big takeaway from that point? Because I'm sure uh that at that age, you know, you're I wouldn't say you're you're you're scared or petrified, but you obviously don't want to make mistakes because it's it's your mom, you don't want to let your mom down, but you you you know the importance of it. So what what what was one of the takeaways that that you came away with?

SPEAKER_01: 4:34

Well, I don't know that I would have said this straight away, but looking back at that time now, I think one of the things that I learned to do quite instinctively, and we do all naturally do this, but was to read people's body language and pick up on their energy and vibration. So where the reception desk was for the salon, there were two glass doors, one to the outside, then a small uh, you know, a very short uh hallway or corridor, and then a second door with glass. So I used to catch people as they were walking in through that first door, and it would give me a few seconds to learn to read their body language and make some assessments of of how they were by the time they'd got to the front of my desk. And bear in mind I might have been doing something else at that time. I could well have had two telephones, one on each ear, talking to people, and I'd also be, you know, eye out for them, or somebody coming round who was coming to pay, or perhaps someone who'd been sat waiting in reception, uh, or a member of the team coming towards me. I really needed to be very vigilant and hypersensitive to like where are these people at so that I could match and mirror with their energy. If someone was coming in looking a bit, you know, flustered and and stressed and like they needed dealing with quickly, I you know, that my my um, you know, I would I I would I would play I would play that back. If somebody looked like they needed some empathy or some like a cup of tea and calming down, then I would I would help with that. So it's um that reading of the nonverbal communication, I think I uh really was able to build a sensitivity to through through that role.

SPEAKER_00: 6:29

Yeah, and that I'm I'm glad you brought that point up because it's so important. But body language, you know, tells us things before we even open our mouths or before they open their mouths. And and I used to to joke, and I still joke with my kids on this, when they were I've got two daughters and they're older now. I could tell when they came down the steps in the morning, get ready for school, whether I should talk to them or not, or whether what what I should say or what I shouldn't say. And and I could I could tell almost immediately, and it it it took me a little bit to to get to that point, but um you know if if you can notice those things, and and and I joked about that, but but in in reality is is if you can notice those things in the people that you're dealing with, that's that's a big piece of building trust and and building the that connection so that you can you can actually have that conversation or or meet their needs without going through a bunch of other stuff.

SPEAKER_01: 7:26

Oh, absolutely. And it's reminding ourselves, isn't it, that only 7% of our communication is the words that we use. The other 93% of communication is how we say it, so through our tone of voice and our nonverbal and our nonverbal communication.

SPEAKER_02: 7:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 7:44

And and I think that's something to be mindful of in today's world where we send a lot of WhatsApp or text messages or emails, that so much of so much of the meaning behind that communication is lost in that in that in that written word. So um, and and the other thing that I think you you you talking there as well is that you you you link this quite rightly back to trust because we are very good at reading people as human beings. And when somebody is masking something, or they're not being congruent with what they're saying and their body language, they're telling you that they really believe in something, but actually their body language is suggesting doubt, you're going you're not going to build trust with that individual. So, you know, being congruent is also I think really important.

SPEAKER_00: 8:48

It it it is because I I I liken it back to to being an educator, you know, if I'm standing in front of a class or if I'm standing in front of an audience or or doing a keynote or a team meeting, if I'm not being honest, if I'm not being authentic, they're gonna see through it really, really quick. And it's it's not it does it doesn't take long, and whatever uh whatever trust or w whatever whatever authority you've built can be lost in in seconds by by not being by not being congruent.

SPEAKER_01: 9:27

Absolutely. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00: 9:30

So you go from uh from work working in in your mom's salon and and then you you get to the point where you're the president and vice president of the professional speaking association association in the United Kingdom in Ireland. What's walk us through your your career from from that perspective? Because I I think that's number one, I think I think it's awesome because you know you go from you know uh a 12-year-old to leading an organization that is so important in terms of of how we of of how we get things done, right? Communication is so important, and and now you're leading that that organization. How did that process happen?

SPEAKER_01: 10:10

Oh gosh. Well, there's a lot of time. I'm an old fogey now, Tim. So yes, there's there's a lot of life that's been lived, a lot of experience that's been gained um along that along that journey. But a very, a very quick rundown was that I so I I finished university uh when I was 21, 22, um, and went into my first role, uh, which included some fantastic training on presenting with impact because my first role out of university, I went to work for Mars and I used to sell their vending machines around the Midlands area in the UK. And presenting with impact, if you're selling, was a really key part of the role. Um, and in fact, I still have to this day the little framework that they gave us. I've got it in a tiny little laminated card and still put my hands on it now underneath my desk here, right where I'm at. Um, and if you're if you're if your listeners would like to see that, I am more than happy to take a photograph of that because I still use some of those very simple practices around how do we structure really good presentations. I still use it today. So it's very old, um, but it's very treasured and very loved. And I'm happy to take a picture of that and share that with the listeners.

SPEAKER_00: 11:39

Oh, please do, please do.

SPEAKER_01: 11:41

Oh, so I will do that.

SPEAKER_00: 11:42

Because it doesn't really matter. I mean, those tried and true principles last forever, right? I mean, it it's there's nothing really new.

SPEAKER_01: 11:53

No, no, it's you know, really, really good, really, really good, really good stuff. And I think the other thing just to share from a a speaking perspective is that whilst I was growing up, I was also part of an amateur dramatics society. So I really loved doing the stage and the theatre, and I'm sure that helped in some respects when I started in the corporate world because I moved from sales eventually into marketing, and then as in those in the marketing roles that I did, not only at Mars, but also at another chocolate company in the UK called Thorntons, and I ultimately became their head of product strategy for them, where I was having to present on a regular basis, whether that be ideas to the board and to the exec team, or whether it be selling ideas in from a brand change perspective, new product ideas to sometimes 300 members of the factory team that were going to be executing it. And so you wanted them to have the same level of care and compassion and um and passion, sorry, not compassion and passion for what they were doing. And so that you know, that that's that was that I think my some of my prior experience was helpful for that. I always remember just one little story. I had been working on a brand relaunch for the biggest brand in the company, and I really wanted to engage with everybody across the business with the launch, and so I had turned up at the factory at six o'clock in the morning to be able to present to those that were starting their shift at that time, and all I could do was to present was to beam some slides up onto a really big blank wall in the factory, and I remember at just before six o'clock, all these people descending into the factory in their white coats and hair nets and coming towards me. It was like a sea of people. There were so many people. And for a for a moment, it felt like I was back on those stages again when I was doing the amateur dramatics. And you know, those really big stage lights with the, you know, with the flaps that kind of direct the light. I felt like this light was like totally on me as all these people were coming towards me. And I had this slight moment of uh of panic and dread and thinking, oh my gosh, how am I going to do this? And then this was the metaphor that I used, and it's helped me so many times since in speaking. Instead of thinking of that stage light on me, because that's how it felt in that moment, it was like I it was like I turned it round and I pointed it on that audience. And I said to myself in that moment, and I don't even know where this came from, but in that moment I said to myself, this isn't about me. This is about these people that are showing up here at six o'clock in the morning, and this is about me connecting with them in a way that they can feel as passionate about this as us as I do. And all of a sudden, it didn't become about me, it became about my connection with those people that were in front of me. And all of a sudden, all that fear, all that dread, it all just disappeared because now it's just it's me making connection and talking to each one of them. And I'll never forget, I'll never forget going into the factory several months later, and we'd been we'd been making so these were assorted chocolates, so in really beautiful chocolate boxes, and they and and and one of the things that the team in the factory had to do was to hand position a bow, a um a beautiful, a beautiful ribbon on the box, and I can remember somebody calling me over saying, Rachel, Rachel, am I getting this bow in just the right place? And she wanted to check with me that she was getting it right. And I was like, this is brilliant, because this is several months after I've done that presentation, and she's you know, she's still thinking and wanting to make sure. Can I just check? Is this right? Are you happy? And yeah, just beautiful.

SPEAKER_00: 16:23

And and I I love that. I love that because it's such an illustration that I think people truly, truly forget, you know, and especially in that situation, um, the people that are a brand's biggest cheerleaders and supporters are those frontline workers. They take such pride in their products or services, and they're the ones that that are doing this by word of mouth. When they go go home, they're talking about all these things that are going on and the quality of the product, and and they they own that internally. And you made them feel like they belonged, like they were were truly a fabric of the organization, and their role truly, truly mattered in how the customers, you know, viewed and consumed the product.

SPEAKER_01: 17:11

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It was critical to me that there was that level of engagement, which hadn't been done in a really long time in the organization. And I think, as you say, it's it's so so so important. And and fast forward, you know, on from on from that, oh gosh, another another 10 years, perhaps even more, to be honest, maybe more like 12. And I find myself out of corporate world. I started my own training and coaching business, and I I happen to meet a wonderful lady who we go out for hot chocolate for, and she's the current vice president of the professional speaking association, and she tells me about this wonderful organization, and I think to myself, well, if I'm on my feet and I'm delivering training, there's got to be a thing or two these professional speakers can teach me about how I can better communicate with my training, and I'm interested to learn. I'm a perpetual student and always learning. And I would say, albeit that, and I know Tim, you'll feel the same way as me with this. I mean, I'm I'm I'm here just sharing some experiences, but by no means do I know it all. And there are just some things I've picked up along the way that I'm very happy to share. And so that was how I got invited into the Professional Speaking Association, and a little over two years later, I found myself running the East Midlands region.

SPEAKER_00: 18:55

That's awesome. I mean, it's it's but you you bring up a a a critical piece that I talk about a lot, and that's that I whole idea of continuous learning. And I spoke with somebody yesterday about, you know, she was telling a story about how she knows somebody who's going to get more degrees, this, that, and the other thing. That's great. I'm not you know just discounting that, but we can be continuous learners and getting better at our craft every day, whatever it is that we're doing. And I think it's important that I try and stress with with my listeners, I I kind of take them on some of the journeys that that that I go on to be a better speaker, to be a better communicator, to be a better podcast host. And like one of the things that I'm working on now with with a coach is telling three-minute stories, you know, taking a story that has meaning or has a purpose that I may take five minutes or have been taking five or six minutes to tell, to getting it down to a succinct three-minute story so that it really comes across with the so the point comes across quickly and I don't lose that audience. You know, so those that that that's what one of the things I'm working on now. But those are things that can happen by by joining, like like you said, the Professional Speaking Association. What so what were some of the things that that you learned and uh was was there anything in there that um you really found fascinating about that process?

SPEAKER_01: 20:23

Though there there are many so I'm still part of the professional speaking association and I'm still learning so much. I I think back to your point around learning as as as well is that you've got to put it into practice. It's great, you get fabulous ideas, you see people that are doing things, but if you're not actually practicing these things, going back to that presenting with impact horse, right at the start of my career, I can remember one of the most uncomfortable things that they made us do as young 20-somethings was video us doing a presentation and then to watch it back. I mean, toe-curlingly oh uncomfortable. However, when we do these things, when we actually put it into practice and we start to experience that in our in our in our in our bodies, that's when it really kind of hits home. And the professional speaking association has given me a wonderful platform to be able to practice. The first thing that I did was that I signed up for a competition that they run actually. It's called the Speaker Factor.

SPEAKER_00: 21:35

Well, I'm I'm so glad you brought that up because I saw the video. I saw that I did. You did you did a phenomenal, phenomenal job of that. You you truly, truly did.

SPEAKER_01: 21:48

Oh, thank you so much. Well, do you know that was the truth is that was the product of months of hard work. So just for the listeners listening in, the speaker factor is a very odd animal in many ways because you have five minutes to tell your story, um, to speak about something that you care about to the audience, which and your audience are professional speakers, you know, they are your peers. And in many respects, uh that, you know, if if public speaking is something that you're scared of anyway, imagine doing it to a bunch of people who are that's actually what they do professionally for their career. And they're gonna judge you on it. It's kind of there's another level of um of uncomfortableness there, I think, for many, for many of us when we first start out. But it's a very warm and welcoming uh organization, and uh the the feedback and things is dealt with very, very, very well. So they would judge you on things like your um your stagecraft and your storytelling and your bookability. And there's so to start with, there's regional heats, and then then any each region has a winner, and those winners from the from the 12 regional heats go through to the finals. And the year that I did make it through to the final, we were actually hosting the Global Speakers Summit. So the the Professional Speaking Association in uh the UK and Ireland is affiliated to the Global Speaking Association. And we were we were hosting uh the Global Speakers Summit that year in Dublin. And so we had people from we had professional speakers from all around the world watching the final. So that video is of me at the um at the Global Speaker Summit in Dublin uh several years ago. And as I say, it really was the product of many, many months of uh of hard work of thinking about how you could really convey something of value within what is a relatively short space of time to be on stage uh talking in that way. And uh it was the it was one of the best things that I have done in recent years. So back to that, putting it into practice, having a go. If you are thinking that you want to speak more confidently, then get out there and do it. Find the opportunities. There are organizations and associations that are desperate for people to come and talk to them about things, whether it's the WI or um, you know, whether it could be a scout, you know, group, or there are there's so many people that would welcome somebody who's passionate about a topic or a subject to be going and talking to them. So just get out there and practice.

SPEAKER_00: 24:48

Right. Right, and that that's that's the key. You don't get better by not doing it. You only you only get better by by doing it. And even if you even if you think that you're not good, you're going to get better by doing it. You know, because you're even if you don't have it somebody telling you, you're gonna you're gonna be able to tell what you need to work on a lot of times. You know, like I I would say for me, four years ago, I I didn't think stagecraft had really any business in what I was doing. I I I didn't even think about it until you know somebody said, you know, your message would come across so much better if you would do this and stop doing this. You know, and it and it comes you know, for for me, somebody who's who's I'm I'm a creature of habit that that that's work. Change changing something that I that just comes natural to be able to convey my message more. I went kicking and screaming down the road doing it, but I did it and and they were right. You know, but it's it's things like like that. You know, learning learning things, learning how to connect with people, you're you're gonna you're gonna do that just by getting out there and talking to people. It's gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01: 25:57

Absolutely. And you know what? I left uh I left a bit of a juicy bit out of that story of my um my journey to the Global Speaker Summit and that speaker factor final. So being completely transparent, I'm gonna share with you all now that I didn't win the regional heat. In fact, I got up there and I spoke at the regional heat and I was utterly, utterly disappointed with my performance. I ran over time, which for professional speakers is you can't do it. I was looking at the floor, I was trying to remember what I was going to say. It was awful. Absolutely. I could have I could have crawled into a hole and you know stayed there for a week. Um and I was really fortunate in many respects. The guy who won, he wasn't able to go to the final. And so by default, the opportunity came to me to represent the region at the final. And so I having it that I think this is the other big lesson. I learned so much from, and it wasn't a failure that that regional heat, but I learned so much about what I needed to do and how I was going to get there. And I had so much incredible support to really help me up my game by the time I got to the Global Speaker Summit. Um, that that getting out there, giving it a go, and even if you feel like I did, like you post-performance anxiety, let's call it that, we've all experienced that from time to time, you know, and just to get to then get you know, to learn from that, dust yourself off. And that's what the community in the Professional Speaking Association is really good for as well, because you've got those people that will help pick you back up and get you back out there again. And I can tell you that when I finished I didn't I didn't win um at the finals, but when I finished my talk on that stage that day, I looked down at the timer, and as I said my last word, the timer clock clicked zero, zero, zero, zero. I was spot on my time. I delivered it a hundred times better than I had done at a regional level, and I felt I could be pleased with myself and what I had achieved. And so I walked off that stage, absolutely buzzing. It didn't matter whether I won or not, because of the journey that I had been on to get there.

SPEAKER_00: 28:48

That's awesome. That's that's such a good story of resiliency and and vulnerabilities, admitting that you know we're not we're not always one. I mean, we there's there's bumps in in the road, and it's how we it's how we deal with them and how we bounce back from it. Um, I never would have known that you that that didn't happen, uh but everybody struggles. It it doesn't I mean e even the best people will have those hiccups and it's okay. And like you said, in that scenario with other professional speakers, they're not judging you, they've been there. Every single one of those people has been in your shoes, and they want you to do well, and they're cheering for you, and and and they want you to to to to succeed, and they want to help you. That's that's the bottom line. They're not that's the the opposite of judging you, which is what what we tell ourselves.

SPEAKER_01: 29:44

Yes, absolutely. And I talk about all this help that I had along the way, and and one little thing which I will share because it's a little bit of fun, and whether whether it helped me or not, I felt like it helped me on the day. And um and that was I spoke to he was actually my old neighbor. So where I grew up at home, um, he lived next door but one to me. And uh actually there's an American connection here because he now lives in America. He's uh he's an actor on days of their lives, and um I think that's a show you have. Yeah, it is, it is. So he's so he's an actor on the show, and I said to him, right, I've got to learn this word for word, because it's like five minutes long, right? You're learning lines every day of the week. Like, tell me how do you do this? And he's and his wife is uh in on Broadway, and uh so he helped me with the lines, he helped me with terms of how to remember them, and then he said to me, uh, right, so you know, Rachel, my wife, one of the things she always does just before a brand new Broadway opening, it's about half an hour before she goes on. She eats a banana and some dark chocolate. I don't know. So all the other contestants, half an hour before this Global Speaker Summit, speaker factor final, were all kind of just around the table, you know, getting mic'd up or what have you. And I'm there stuffing my face with a banana and eating chocolate, and they're all looking at me, going, How can you eat right now? And I'm like, Exactly.

SPEAKER_00: 31:18

That's awesome. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_01: 31:21

So um, yeah, anyway, I'm sure there's somebody who's got better scientific knowledge than I have that will possibly tell us what the ingredients are in the uh or the you know, the the the the things that a banana and some dark chocolate can do that might just help calm our nerves and does be in a good uh you know, that maybe it's those endorphins that all come through that will be in a good place for when you start. So I just a bit of fun. Wanted to share that as well.

SPEAKER_00: 31:46

But I I I I think it's awesome. You you you found what what works for you, and because I I'm a pacer, I pace. And I'm and I'm I'm having those, the, the conversation in my head, and I and I'm you know uh you know, r running down the the the time, I you know, three minutes and you gotta be here, seven minutes, I gotta be here, 15 minutes, I gotta be there. And and running through that, you know, which may be helpful, maybe not, but that's what works for for for me. It may not work for somebody else. But finding your way, that's I I don't know that I can stress that enough because you know, of all the people that go out and have to talk in front of people, we all have to find our own way of doing it. There's not one right way. We can help you, we can guide you, we can do these things, but ultimately you've got to find what's actually gonna work for you.

SPEAKER_01: 32:32

Absolutely. And uh another thing that I absolutely found super valuable just before going on stage was to take a few minutes outside the main room and to do some of that power posing and visualizing and just thinking about the audience, not about me. Uh and there was a str and then when I walk back in the room, it's almost strangely like a I can completely feel it now. I walk back into the room with a a completely different energy. There was no nervous energy. I stood at the back of the room, I watched the speaker that was in the competition directly before me, and I stood from a place of this is this is me here to you know to learn, to receive, to connect, uh, to be with these people in this room. That energy is quite um expansive and open-armed and that you know outward reaching, and it's not at all about you know me and my performance. And that I think really helped me to deliver, to deliver on that on that day.

SPEAKER_00: 33:51

Are you gonna go through that process again?

SPEAKER_01: 33:55

Uh well, well, so they have now that this so this year's the first year that they're doing it. They've they've they've done another competition. So the speaker factor was always for new and emerging speakers.

SPEAKER_02: 34:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 34:10

Now got a special competition for professional speakers, which is the category I would now fall into. So maybe Tim. I'm not gonna give too much.

SPEAKER_00: 34:22

You should. You should, you should, you should. Uh and and uh so some some of the the stuff that I'm doing with with the John Maxwell leadership team is you know is going through the process of stage time. And I tell people, whether you whether you've done it before, whether you haven't done it before, it's you everybody should do it because you get that practice. You get that practice of telling that story. You get that, you get the coaching of uh, you know, figuring out what uh that big story is and then getting it down to what it really means, what the piece that you really want to say. And then whether you get chosen for stage time or whether you get chosen for to to compete, that you you you now have something in your toolbox that you can pull out at any time at it for you know for for any for any for any any speaking engagement, um maybe change a little bit here or there, but you you already have a a pre-crafted story that you could tell that's gonna you know make a point. And so you for me right now I'm working on uh five different stories. And just and just just think about that for for the audience, think about think about that, right? You know, five minute five three minute stories, that's 15 minutes. And uh by the time by March, let's just say by March, those five stories are gonna be refined to the point if I were to go and do a keynote on something, maybe three of them are gonna fit that keynote. Okay. I can I can insert them and it's and and it will help build that build that that whole keynote and to and until whatever thing you you want to do. But that that's that's the piece why you should do it, Rachel. I mean, because it's whatever we have up here, uh they will coach you to get it bound down to the point that is actually gonna resonate and add value to the audience.

SPEAKER_01: 36:19

Absolutely, absolutely. It's such a key thing, that storytelling, isn't it? And and and even just thinking about and I think so. One of the things that I've learned through the Professional Speaking Association is that the stories don't have to be all big heroic stories. And I think sometimes some of us as speakers can maybe get fooled into thinking, well, I've not climbed Everest, or I'm not a Paralympian, or I've not got, you know, one of these huge heroic stories to share. But actually, they can have their limitations because if your audience members aren't, you know, elite endurance athletes or something like that, you know, then then you know, all of a sudden you telling a huge heroic story, whilst it can be inspiring and incredibly interesting for them to make that connection back, you know, kind of with with with well, what well how how do I do this then? How do I make that leap? What do I do? You know, you've got to really, you know, help connect the dots with that. So I think to remember that the stories can even be the little tiny stories. Like I tell a story about my toothbrush battery running out.

SPEAKER_00: 37:40

Oh that's the worst. That's what are you gonna do?

SPEAKER_01: 37:43

That's that's a mini, but it helps me illustrate something that I that I talk about. That's a mini everyday kind of scenario. So um, yeah, I would just remind everybody that those stories, little ones, pub stories, as I would call them, because I'm from the UK, of course, you know, but little little everyday stories, pub stories, and heroic stories, they all have their place.

SPEAKER_00: 38:05

They do.

SPEAKER_01: 38:06

And uh they're they're all they're all super valuable.

SPEAKER_00: 38:10

All right, so I'm gonna tell you one. So I'm working on one that combines where my my wife gave me up for New Year's resolution. I I gave her up for Lent, and when I asked her dad if I could marry her, he said no. So I'm working on a fun on a funny story about you know about that, and now we've been married for almost 30 years.

SPEAKER_01: 38:37

Oh gosh.

SPEAKER_00: 38:42

So it's you know it I d I'm I'm working on so I don't I I don't really want to tell it, but it's a funny story. Uh but it's also a uh a story about you know, just because somebody's uh says or does something, if you work on it, it can it'll work. You know, it it it everything will turn out. Um but it it well anyway, we'll we'll just leave it there and and and we'll keep working on it.

SPEAKER_01: 39:08

You are leaving us on a cliffhanger. I want to hear the story. I want to hear the story.

SPEAKER_00: 39:13

Well, is essentially essentially, um I my current wife is my second wife. Um I I call her my forever wife. My first wife was a starter wife, and um when I met her, I told her I I'm never getting married again. And this is you know almost 30 years ago. And she said, Okay, okay, okay. And when our our personalities are very different, are very, very different. And it's it's that that's what kind of said, well, she said, Well, I'm done with you. I'm giving you up for for New Year's. It lasted about New Year's resolution, it lasted about a week, and then I I gave her up for Lent, and then we moved in together like a week after that didn't work out either. Um her her grandfather is a was a colonel in the army, and he came to the house and said, Well, as long as you live with him and not be married, you know, I'm never gonna answer your phone call, never gonna I'm never going to receive a letter. And I said, Well, I can't do that. I'm not doing that to you. So I asked her dad to marry. He said no. And we eloped.

SPEAKER_02: 40:20

Uh-huh. Yeah. And oh my god.

SPEAKER_00: 40:24

Yeah. Oh, when I asked her to marry me, she said she she had to think about it. I forgot about that piece. Shit. Yeah, she had to think about it.

SPEAKER_01: 40:34

Oh, there's so there's so much in this, isn't it? Yeah. And and and and you remind me because so we had a brilliant, um, still there, brilliant woman join the professional speaking association a couple of years ago. And I would um, yeah, people should definitely look her up. Her name's Beth Sherman. She's a seven times Emmy Award-winning comedy writer, and so she's written for the Oscars, for Tom Hanks, for Ellen DeGeneres, for the David Letterman show. And what she talks about is the incredible ability of humor to connect. And when we can connect through our humor, we're in a much better place to have the influence and the impact that we want to have with our audiences. And um, yeah, so uh she's oh she she honest and one of the things she always says to me is truth is funny, Rachel. Truth is funny, and um there's so much, there's so much, so much in that.

SPEAKER_00: 41:40

It there there really is, and you've you've got to give the the audience, I I think time to digest uh the the the the humor as well. So you can't just it's you can't just say something funny and then just keep moving on. You get you've gotta let them dive into it and and embrace it because that's what really makes that it makes that impact as well.

SPEAKER_01: 42:08

So I think the humor so I got caught I got caught today. So true story from my life earlier today. I was due to be delivering a training session to 25 senior leaders, large corporate organization. I didn't realize it until I got in the room today, but the CEO of the company was also there listening to this particular training session that I was going to be running for two hours. Half an hour before we're due to go live. I'm on with the lady from the company who's brilliant at helping me back of house. And my computer's not running properly. Brand new computer. I say to her, I'm gonna turn it off and turn it back on again because yeah, often solves everything, right?

SPEAKER_02: 42:57

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 42:58

My computer would not switch back on again. No word of a lie. I tried it seven times. I'm on the phone to Apple. Like, what is going on? Uh-oh. I do have a laptop, but it like is covered in dust because I haven't like dusting it off because I haven't had it out for ages. And you can imagine starting that up, downloading the documents. And you know, that uh in starting that meeting today with that audience, because I was a little bit late, and because the senior leader who was sponsoring the event needed to kick off without me properly being there and and all of the rest of it, when I did come in and come on, it's like, well, you know, this this whole technology thing is proof that even in inanimate objects can hold a grudge, you know, and and it's just, you know, it just does feel some days that that technology has got a life of its own and it's completely against you. Um you know, I'm just honestly saying to people, you know, this, you know, we worked really hard. We met we met half an hour yesterday and hot and this morning to get things up and running, you know, believe it, believe it or not. And just something that is a little bit sometimes self-deprecate. Um, or even just that light little bit of humor, even when things go wrong, because I think as a speaker, it can be easy to get quite het up about that and can cause you. And I was concerned, of course I was, but just being able to keep your cool in those moments, make a little bit of a joke and a laugh about it, um, and then and then and then move on.

SPEAKER_02: 44:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 44:38

So humor, just absolutely amazing. You've got so many humorous bits in that story. I cannot wait to to hear.

SPEAKER_00: 44:44

Yeah, well that that's that's that's my style as well. You know, it's the self-deprecating humor, it's the the dry deadpan stuff. And um but you know, that's that's just my way. It's just my style, and and it it I I think sometimes you know being that conversational style really does disarm even the the critics in the room um who may who may not agree with what you're saying, who may not like what you're saying. That's that's really kind of dis disarming in in a way that that kind of works for me.

SPEAKER_02: 45:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 45:14

Well, Rachel, thank you so so much for spending some time with us again. Um I I can't tell you how much I appreciate it. I I love our conversations. Um, but uh tell people again where they can connect with you.

SPEAKER_01: 45:26

The best place to connect with me would be through my website, which is elevar.co.uk, and that's spelt E-L-L-E-V-A-R. Or to connect with me on LinkedIn if anything that we've been talking about has resonated with you here. I would love for you to connect. Drop me a message and let me know. And it's just Rachel Edmondson Clark. And if there's an extra letter that you can add to my name, be sure to do it because then you'll get the spelling correct. It's A-E-L for Rachel Clark with an E, and it's Edmondson. So yes, there we go. Rachel Edmondson Clark on LinkedIn or at elevar.co.uk.

SPEAKER_00: 46:03

Awesome. Thank you so much. Take care, and I look forward to talking to you soon.

SPEAKER_01: 46:07

Tim, thank you. Take care too.

SPEAKER_00: 46:11

Be sure to visit speakingwithconfidence podcast.com to get your free ebook, the top 21 challenges for public speakers, and how to overcome them. You can also register for the Form for Public Speaking course. Always remember your voice has a power to change a word. We'll talk to you next time. Take care.